Indoor or Outdoor? What's Next for the Scarsdale Pool?

Scarsdale loves our pool complex! A survey conducted by Village consultants found that there’s one point on which almost everyone can agree. 95% of respondents to a statistically valid survey said the pool should be preserved, so the question is not if, but what should be built.

And unlike other proposed capital projects, doing nothing is not an option. As the Mayor explained in her opening comments at a work session on Wednesday September 28, 2022, “At over 50 years old, the pool has outlived its expected life. While to our summer patrons, the pool complex is the same idyllic gathering and recreation spot, beneath the ground it has severe problems that cannot be remedied without significant capital expenditures, an effective rebuilding of the complex…. Village staff has been sounding the alarm that our pool complex is barely hanging on, and they fear a major shutdown. With constant emergency repairs and struggles to find replacement parts, and a necessity to bring the complex in line with current health codes. staff impressed upon the board the need to take action.”

Village Manager Rob Cole concurred. He said, “There has been increasing staff concern with each passing fiscal year that the pool complex could suffer an unexpected and possibly extended closure due to some combination of failure in a major system and the complexities of potentially cascading repairs arising from replacing very old equipment and infrastructure. To quote Rich Strobel, one of the Recreation Department’s unsung heroes in keeping the facility operational, “The unseen infrastructure of the pool is falling apart.” He continued, “It takes a herculean effort by our staff to keep this pool operational. Every morning at the pool is like triage, we see what problems have occurred overnight and deal with them.””

Cole explained where the Village now stands in a well thought out plan to determine what is needed, what the community would like to see and what is financially and environmentally sustainable, including:

• Pool Complex Existing Conditions Assessment
• Market Study to Understand the Competitive Landscape
• Statistically Valid Community Survey
• Online Survey
• In-Person Engagement

A presentation from the consultants on Wednesday 9-28 was the next step in this process.

Bill Simmons from Aquatectonic provided background on the firm and their actions to date. The conditions assessment showed that the complex is beyond repair. He said, “The facility is at risk of being shut down…. The Scarsdale community supports the pool – it is a beautiful facility…
We are at a decision point – this 54 year old pool is on borrowed time. 54 years is a working maximum. We did an existing conditions survey that identifies many issues with the facility, the mechanicals, pool infrastructure as well as energy and water waste. There is an 80 page report. Pipes are corroded and the cement is falling away. The operational costs have risen to do the repairs. The facility is not code compliant and there are also accessibility issues. One repair could trigger major upgrades.”

He reviewed the survey results to see what respondents valued and found that the top aquatic amenities were a wading pool, deep and shallow water, children’s amenities and diving boards, and favored non-aquatic features were concessions, shade and sunbathing and the lawn.

What did respondents wish to see? Warmer water, via a heating system and children’s activities came out on top.

The survey also indicated that respondents were willing to pay a higher membership fee to underwrite a better complex.

-87% would pay $400-$599 in higher individual membership rates
-91% would pay $700-$999 or higher for a seasonal family membership (which is now priced at $640.)

Most surprising, the community appears to be split between a seasonal vs. a year-round facility with an indoor pool. 50% of the community supports an indoor pool and 45% says seasonal is enough.

Half of survey respondents asked for an indoor pool too.Armed with the data the consultants provided ballpark estimates for an enhanced outdoor pool complex and a year-round facility that includes an indoor pool.

They estimated that an enhanced seasonal facility would cost somewhere between $20-$30 million, which translates to a $208 per year tax increase for the average household in Scarsdale. What does enhanced mean? Though these features have not yet been selected, at a minimum this would include new locker rooms, a new concession stand or restaurant along with a completely redone pool complex.

An outdoor/indoor pool complex is estimated at $40-$50 million, which would mean a tax increase of $302-$397 per year for the average Scarsdale household.

In order to estimate the financial viability of both scenarios, the consultants made assumptions about membership numbers which have declined from 2010 to 2021 but saw a resurgence in the summer of 2022. Will more individuals and households join the pool if it is rebuilt and enhanced? Take a look at the analysis here.

Commenting on the report, all the trustees agreed that Scarsdale values it’s pool and that it will need to be rebuilt, in one form or another.

Karen Brew said, “The pool cannot exist as is – underneath the surface it is falling apart.
The cost to repair it is way higher than anyone would have liked. We know that this will impact taxes. We need to prioritize based on what the community is willing to pay for.”

Ken Mazer said, “I will listen carefully to the community. It will be a series of compromises to meet people’s needs from a recreational and financial perspective.”

Sameer Ahuja said, “I am developing a point of view around the seasonal facility. We should not ignore the people who filled out the surveys. A lot of people have spoken. They feel that they have filled out the survey. I view Scarsdale as an aspirational place. It is a community of generations. You never own the pool; you build it for the next generation.”

Jonathan Lewis said he was informed by his service both on the Village Board and the School Board. He said, “The characteristic that makes our community have lasting value is that we tackle big issues and take the long view. We have to do something – will it have enduring and lasting value and propel our community forward, that binds generations? It’s a great moment for us to tackle this. Interest rates are low, and we have a great bond rating.”

Randall Whitestone provided a historical perspective. He said, “I am delighted in the process and the community interest. This is but one step in the road. I fully subscribe to the idea that we need to do something to preserve this asset. (Mayor) Carol Stix made the pool possible. It opened on June 1, 1969, one month before man landed on the moon.”Outdoor options

Jeremy Gans said he was “glad that our consultants had the opportunity to share these concepts. It’s clear that the community wants the pool. I have not met a single person who wants to close the pool. Families watched their kids grow up there, learning to swim and dive. This is step one in a long process. Once we have a feeling for what the community wants we can start the design process. I look forward to creating a pool that will serve the community for the next 50 years.”

Mayor Jane Veron said, “The pool is a treasure. The community has built long lasting memories there. It bridges generations and infuses the warmth and spirit that makes Scarsdale a special place. I was personally surprised by the cost. We have to be fiscally prudent.”

A long line of speakers, both in person and via Zoom expressed a range of views. Some of the senior residents hoped to limit the changes to repairs and maintain the pool as is, while others were eager for enhancements, an indoor pool and other amenities and thought that the price tag was reasonable.

Susan Levine of Ardmore Road said she moved here in 1969, the year that Molly Goldstein won her battle to build a pool. She questioned the survey response saying, “They should not have surveyed people who have never joined the pool. I was on Jeopardy I know a few things… An indoor pool has been considered and turned down twice. I went to the pool almost every day this summer. Everyone agreed that they loved the pool just the way it is. They had two suggestions: A better more reliable heating system and better shower and locker room facilities.” She said, “The character of the pool complex, for those who use it, should not be changed. The pool project needs to stay on budget and the character needs to be maintained.”

Marilyn Hahn at 50 Popham Road agreed with Levine, saying “We want to fix it. Don’t take away the tree.”

Another senior, Mr. Leitner said, “If it ain’t broke don’t fix it. We need the pipes replaced, the showers, the locker rooms. I originally read there was a cost estimate of $11 million…. We are the only ones on our street of eight houses that belongs to the pool. We want to keep our taxes down. I know someone who works for the Village who says it can be fixed for much less.”

Some used the decline in membership rates to justify minimizing expenses.

However, an enthusiastic group hoped to see more.

Judith Eforo of Sprague Road said that as the mother of four children she has spent many years at the pool. She supported separate pools for babies and toddlers and hoped that the trustees would consider the indoor option especially for the high school swim team.

A Black Birch Road resident said, “I am willing to pay 15% more taxes to keep it the way it is. If it is not, I would think of moving out of Scarsdale. I would rather have the outdoor facility then compromise to build an indoor one. We could raise money having it open late and having a decent restaurant with alcohol.”

Diane Gurden of Colvin Road said, “Friends with young children asked you to keep a children’s pool.” Suggesting revenue building ideas, she said, “We could rent lounge chairs – a revenue source. We could also rent out swim lanes to swim teams to raise money.”

Edie Moulton from Edgewood Road ran to the meeting. She urged the trustees to “Listen to the survey not to us.” She said, “This is a low cost proposal! An indoor/outdoor pool for under $50 million or a $400 tax increase for a new pool.” She said, “Everyone from Edgewood belongs to the pool.We can’t stand still. We have to improve it so that the Fox Meadow and Heathcote people come too.”

Anita Singal of Mamaroneck Road gave a passionate appeal to invest in the facility. She said, “I have lived here for ten years. My real estate agent took me there first. I have two kids on the swim team. We love the pool. We want to see it renovated. We have seen the decline in it.
We want it to be safe, up to code and an indoor pool would be great too. That would be a welcome change.”

Radhika Dewan was also a fan of improvements. She said, “I have made most of my closest friends at the pool. It is like a summer getaway. In 2 minutes I feel like I am at a resort. I think we should work hard to preserve the lawn. My kids are on the swim team and I travel far for practices. It would be amazing if we could explore an indoor facility – but I am not sure how we could do that while preserving the green aesthetic.

Carol Silverman, speaking for herself and other senior residents said, We appreciate the adult leisure lane. I would prefer an indoor pool with a community space. That’s my opinion. I would like to have an indoor pool as well.”

Rodrigo Pascualy of Rock Creek Lane explained, “I moved here from California where I had a pool at my house. But the sense of community (at the Scarsdale Pool) is nice. It is something special. I don’t see these costs as outrageous. I think it would be worth a lot for the seniors to be able to swim in the winter. You need a vision of what you want for the next 50 years. Our taxes are being invested in our children’s education. The community is a great place.”

Scott Mishara of Nelson Road said, “There are so many people like me with young kids who can’t come. I do think that the pool should be enhanced for younger kids. It is not that expensive on a per home basis. Keep the park like atmosphere.”

Rachel Einstein said she grew up here and that her two sisters and her parents were all living in Scarsdale. She said, “The pool represents a huge community asset even though I look at my tax bill with trepidation. I agree with what Trustee Lewis said to look at the long term.”

Harris Sokoloff of Heathcote Road said he moved here this year. About the pool, he said “It’s gorgeous. It reminded me of the bungalow colonies…The pool structure is broken and membership is declining. The pool can’t sustain the financial model if it is not enhanced. A splash pad would be amazing.”

Following the comments, the consultants answered several questions. About the reasons for the decline in membership, they said that data had been collected and would be released to the public in a survey report.

Others asked why the original estimate to repair the pool was $11 million, but the current estimate for an enhanced seasonal pool was $20- $30 million. Consultants replied that the $11 million estimate was not fully loaded with actual construction costs, including permits and fees. Also, as it turns out, repairing the existing facility was not feasible if the entire facility needs to be brought up to code. A new locker room building, a new concession stand are needed.

What are the next steps? Village Managers will consider the input they received from the surveys and working sessions and set up meetings with smaller community groups to explore their views on the seasonal vs. year-round option and to assess the financial viability of the plans. From there, they will move to the design phase to review scenarios for the layout of the complex.

Commenting after the meeting, Mayor Veron said, "We were gratified by the strong community turnout, demonstrated level of interest, and passionate support for the pool complex. There is no doubt that our residents love our pool, and they appreciate the need to reinvest in its future. Our consultants did an excellent job sharing the survey results and linking them to conceptual options for consideration. We now aim to move forward with our continuing community conversation, to help guide the refinement of the broad concepts we heard about last night, and align our wishes with our willingness to pay."

Want to take a deeper dive into the data? The results from the surveys are now posted here along with the presentation from September 28. 2022.

Have something to say? Village Manager Rob Cole said that new email address has been opened to receive comments from the public on the pool complex. If you have thoughts you wish to share, send them to: poolcomments@scarsdale.com.